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  1. #1
    Gimik's Avatar
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    Table Trouble

    Hi there Im new here and to html as well. Got stuck trying to make some tables. Basically I wanted to make the navigation table on the left then a space then a section for the news to the right of it. But when I try to make the table it ends up below the navigation table. Hope this makes sense. My site is at members.cox.net/agathon1. To clarify I want a table to go to the right of the nav and below the Title above it. Thanks for any help and for the great site you have.

    I just uploaded my new html file to better help in pointing out my problem. I want the text at the bottom of the page to be pushed up next to the navigation table but with a space inbetween.
    Last edited by Gimik; 02-25-2002 at 01:45 AM.

  2. #2
    amit_vadnagr's Avatar
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    Thumbs up Table Trouble

    Dear Gimik,
    Try this, may be its what you want.

    <table width=90% border=1 bgcolor=black cellspacing=2 cellpadding=2 align="center" valign="middle">
    <tr>
    <td width=15% valign=top><font color="red">Info<font color="white"><br>News<br>Submit News<br>Doctrine<br>FAQ<br>Contact<br><font color="red">The Guild<br><font color="white">Members<br>Forum<br>Recruiting<br><font color="red">Links<br><font color="white">Shadowbane</td>
    <td valign=top><font color=white>Well I finally got this piecer of a page up and running although it isnt the way I wanted it to be. I will keep working dammit, so says I, Ome the Mydee!!! "Is this what you want?????"
    </td>
    </tr>
    </table>

    Thanks & Regards,

  3. #3
    Gimik's Avatar
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    Thanks for the help Amit but thats not what I am trying to do. Its close though and I am able to do that already. What I want is that, with a space inbetween the two tables, the space will be like the gray background with no border, so I assume they would be 2 separate tables? Any help is appreciated and I hope to not sound ungrateful for your attempt already. Thanks much.

  4. #4
    HTML's Avatar
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    Help with tables

    Hi Gimik, welcome to the forums

    I think the best way to get the results you want is thru the use of nested tables.

    Nested tables is the process of inserting tables within tables, always in the <td> tags

    Here is an example.

    Begin by making a single row, 3 colum table:

    <table>
    <tr>
    <td></td>
    <td></td>
    <td></td>
    </tr>
    </table>

    Now that you have 3 cells we populate each of those cells with its own table

    <table>
    <tr>
    <td>
    <table><tr><td></td></tr></table>
    </td>
    <td>
    <table><tr><td></td></tr></table>
    </td>
    <td>
    <table><tr><td></td></tr></table>
    </td>
    </tr>
    </table>

    all we have done is insert the line <table><tr><td></td></tr></table> in each table cell.

    *Note: it is important to add valign="top" to each td tag within the parent table

    <table>
    <tr>
    <td valign="top">
    <table><tr><td>content</td></tr></table>
    </td>
    <td valign="top">
    <table><tr><td>content</td></tr></table>
    </td>
    <td valign="top">
    <table><tr><td>content</td></tr></table>
    </td>
    </tr>
    </table>

    Hope this is helpful
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  5. #5
    Gimik's Avatar
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    Table Trouble

    Thanks so much Dave this is exactly what I was trying to do. Good to know there are people who still help others. Also want to thank Amit again as well. Really, really, appreciate this help as it has had me stumped for awhile now. I was trying all sorts of crazy things in order to do this without ever knowing anything about nested table. Woot well back to work for me thanks again fellas.

  6. #6
    Derek's Avatar
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    lol amet once you learn html you should start working on CSS next, Dean did my code really used to look like that? haha jk amet lets just say it cuts all those <font> tags outa there...

  7. #7
    amit_vadnagr's Avatar
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    table trouble

    Hello Gimik,

    as master is back, your probs are solved.
    buddyyy even i too am a child in this WebAuthoring world, my suggestion was a polite effort if i can help someone, though it could not do much for u, but inspired me to still work hard on understanding HTML.

    thanks & regards,

  8. #8
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    Re: table trouble

    Originally posted by amit_vadnagr


    i too am a child in this WebAuthoring world

    I see web authoring itself as a child, still growing and changing.

    Speaking for myself, I learn as much as you do from these forums, and some of it is still wayyy over my head

    Dave
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  9. #9
    Derek's Avatar
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    I ment nothing by it. Just a suggestion cause many (like I used to) just stuck with plain html after learning html. Until your ready

  10. #10
    QuietDean's Avatar
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    /me still learning too!

    One of the things I love about webdesign is there is NEVER an end to what you can learn.

    Even though I started using CSS a lot, there are still many area of good-old-fashioned html I need to learn about.

    So, here, we can all learn together....
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  11. #11
    benzden's Avatar
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    QuietDean:

    I've always hesitated from using css because it seemed just to introduce another level of administration and "extra time" to web site development. Most of my similiarly designed pages, such as

    http://thomas.ciriacks.com and http://jim.ciriacks.com

    have unique TABLEs and differing FONTs for various internal segments.

    What time savings could I introduce by having those (and a dozen other similar but uniquely, internally configured) sites controlled by an external .css file?

    (I'm not looking for specifics but am under the impression that all the sites would have to look pretty much the same, with same FONTs, COLORs, TABLEs in order to save time with .css.)

  12. #12
    QuietDean's Avatar
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    heh...you want me to sell it to you?

    I can sell css

    Okay, heres two, very simple scenarios, that have actually happened to me before I started using style sheets.

    1) Simple site, about 10 pages. Black background, white writing. Highlighted writing in silver. Looked okay. Reasonably happy with it.

    One evening, my friend, Jamie, walks in. He thinks that a blue background with yellow writing would look a lot better than the eye-straining combination I had on at the moment. So I spend 25 minutes hunting through my code and finding all the font tags, and bgcolor tags.

    10 pages later...Jamie says 'Actually, it looked better before. Sorry.' I could've killed him. So I changed it back.
    Altogether, around 70-80 minutes work for nothing.

    With my sites the way they are currently designed, the whole thing would have taken less than a minute (all in a single file, 3 values to change). Job done.

    2) 'A border around a table'.

    I wanted a border. plain and simple. It needed to be 'double lined' as it were.However, the default borders around tables I was none too happy with. I played with nested tables, I played with images. I played with background colours. I got really clever with it, came up with loads of new, exciting ideas. None of them worked, or even came close.

    Eventually (2-3 hours) I got something close to what I wanted. However, it put the borders around each table cell. No! I just wanted it around the table!

    Thats when I started looking at CSS. In the first CSS guide I found, I built my first css rule -

    Code:
    table {
    border-width: 1px;
    border-style: double;
    border-color: #000000;
    }
    Thats was it. Took about 20 minutes to figure from scratch. Doh.


    The points I am trying to put across are that not only does CSS make the work you do now easier to do/amend/totally upgrade, but it also makes possible some things that are totally impossible with html.

    html is meant for data. Cascading Style Sheets are for Style.
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  13. #13
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    Doh

    Just re-read your post, and realised I may have missed the point.

    CSS has 'classes', 'id' and 'contextual selectors'.

    Basically, I can set a rule for everything with a 'class' of 'badger'. Then only thing with -

    Code:
    <a href="badger.html" class="badger">Badger</a>
    a class="badger" tag in them get effected. Or with contextuals, I can set a rule so that only things with a class of 'badger' that are in a <p> tag are affected.

    So no, css is not limiting in any way. In fact, you will probably find a certain freedom using css.
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  14. #14
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    That class= sounds good, but if I have 36 different classes for various idiocycracies at the 600+ web pages I have, then it's going to be harder remembering what's in each of those classes than having the code itself displayed right in the file I'm editing.

    The borders around tables is something I know will make most of my sites look a lot better - will look into that. Maybe it will pull me futher into .css, but the primary problem is then having two files to look at while editing the primary -- a problem with popups and frames the decreases editing efficiency.

    In other words, when all the code is in the same file, it's easier to change, debug, refine, search on, compare and/or eliminate.

    An example of the opposite approach are the browser programs themselves - they have so many modules doing so many disparate things that rather than try to fix what's there, the programmers just keep adding on more code and more modules -- eventually, one will have to have a super-computer just to load and run the damn browser, with most of the code being useless and unneeded (and not understood by programmers who weren't around when the original was designed).

    - - - - -

    Okay, I just saved your home and style pages, edited the .css to change the dark green text which I can't read to #00ff00 (lime), which I can and only had to make two changes to the .css file to affect both pages (and presumably the others which I didn't save.).

    So, those files are going to serve as the basis for my first .css usage. Now,

    What's a good CSS Bible?

    Got a URL to a page that has a thick nice border around the entire page via .css?

    Last edited by benzden; 02-28-2002 at 04:05 PM.

  15. #15
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    Dean made some tutorials on that a hwile back I think if you look around Daves sections you still might find it under the tutorials. I don't know of any books cause I learned CSS from Deans tutorials and just learning it as I go from Dean.

    Browsing problems:

    Thats why they invented XHTML and HTML will soon be transfered to minimize 'useless code' haha

    Um that border code he gave you should work just test it out it'll be a nice thick border I think

    Ya you can never stop learning... never haha. There's just so much to learn! Can give ya headaches soemtimes



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